WISN may be going HD soon i think

[khafferkamp]

I was the one who posted the TMJ4 thread. I was watching WISN today and saw that a camera lost signal and the color bars said microwave truck 1 camera SD and i have noticed other things like during good morning america WISN has a croll bar on the HD send without downgrading to SD and 12 news video is clearer than cbs 58 and fox 6 tmj4 is pretty much the same quality what does everyone else think will wisn go HD soon?

[Nels Harvey]

WTMJ always tries to be first. This might be interesting!

[Bluto]

I had my hopes up until that evil bastage, Tim Cuprisin, crushed them yesterday*:

"And just in case you're wondering, there are no Milwaukee newscasts ready to take the plunge into the ultra-sharp world of high-definition broadcasting.

"It’s coming, of course, but there’s no real impetus to invest the money right now.

"The equipment costs money, and local high-def programming doesn’t bring in any specific advertising revenue."

He also mentions that no local network affiliates are able to store syndicated HD for later playback .

http://www.jsonline.com/story/index.aspx?id=776894

* Just kidding - Tim is NOT an evil bastage. I think. :D

[khafferkamp]

if no shows can be stored in HD how can TMJ4 Play back the today show a hour later after the morning blend

[LoadStar]

if no shows can be stored in HD how can TMJ4 Play back the today show a hour later after the morning blend

They probably pick up on the west coast feed.

[Mags]

That's too funny.

They are too cheap to go HD in Milwaukee, because advertising won't pay for it.

It's funny - Tampa has had 2 channels doing news in HD for 18 months now.

I guess FL people are dumb, because for some reason it makes sense down there to do the news right. I doubt the advertising market is all that much different in Tampa than Milwaukee. They are both very similiar markets, I believe, in terms of size.

[jjallou]

That's too funny.

They are too cheap to go HD in Milwaukee, because advertising won't pay for it.

It's funny - Tampa has had 2 channels doing news in HD for 18 months now.

I guess FL people are dumb, because for some reason it makes sense down there to do the news right. I doubt the advertising market is all that much different in Tampa than Milwaukee. They are both very similiar markets, I believe, in terms of size.

According to AVSFORUM http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=453241

Tampa is DMA market 13 while Milwaukee is DMA market 33. That's a fairly large difference in size in terms of DMA placement.

[WITI6fan]

"And just in case you're wondering, there are no Milwaukee newscasts ready to take the plunge into the ultra-sharp world of high-definition broadcasting.


I've been told differently. :D

[js6751]

I've been told differently. :D

Can you elaborate at all?

[Bluto]

I've been told differently. :D

I'd be thrilled if that is true. What's the timeline?

[Tom Snyder]

4, 12 and 58 have all indicated Q1 2009. 6 had no predictions because they were being sold. No word since the new owners have taken over, but as much local news as they do, and how fierce the ratings battles are for top news station in this market, it wouldn't be surprising if they took the plunge first.

[WITI6fan]

Can you elaborate at all?
I rather not. ;)

I'd be thrilled if that is true. What's the timeline?
Supposedly, soon.

Edit:
4, 12 and 58 have all indicated Q1 2009.
I've always thought WDJT would be last to go HD. Now that I think about it, they have so little stuff (one live truck, two studio cameras, no actual set) that it would be very easy for them to go HD.

[basshive]

I've been told differently.


I rather not.

unfair taunting :P

[js6751]

I rather not. ;)


Supposedly, soon.

Edit:

I've always thought WDJT would be last to go HD. Now that I think about it, they have so little stuff (one live truck, two studio cameras, no actual set) that it would be very easy for them to go HD.


Ahhh, soon. My favorite word. Come on, we promise we won't tell anyone;) ! Can you tell us if it will be this month at all (august)? I just read that the NBC station in Richmond, VA just went HD (and they're #59 DMA:eek: )!

[WITI6fan]

Ahhh, soon. My favorite word. Come on, we promise we won't tell anyone;) ! Can you tell us if it will be this month at all (august)? I just read that the NBC station in Richmond, VA just went HD (and they're #59 DMA:eek: )!

Mmmmm, Ok. It will reportedly happen this month unless some stuff doesn't get worked out.

[basshive]

Not to nit pick but this month ends today? Or do you mean August? :)

[Bluto]

Not to nit pick but this month ends today? Or do you mean August? :)

:D

I'd be just fine with August. Of 2008.

[js6751]

Should we assume that he's talking about FOX 6?

[LoadStar]

Should we assume that he's talking about FOX 6?

Not necessarily. FOX6fan is just his screen name, but based on what I've seen, he follows all the local news media.

My gut says WTMJ is most likely. NBC really wanted as many affiliates to go HD as possible by the Olympics, from what I've heard. I don't think WTMJ will make that sort of deadline though.

Next most likely is WISN, who have done local HD longer than anyone, save Milwaukee Public TV.

Third up would be WITI, who just retrofitted their main studio and added a brand new studio from scratch, one that is HD ready I'd presume. Still, HD is more than just a set - it's the cameras and everything in the control room. Dunno how much of that was upgraded - I have a faint memory that WITI also upgraded their control room, or at least the switchboard, not too long ago as well.

WDJT is the dark horse candidate. They operate so close to the bone it would shock me if they splurged on HD. Still, it would be a good way for them to make a big (if temporary) splash in the market.

(I know! It's Sinclair - they're bringing back a newscast on WVTV!!! ;))

[WITI6fan]

Third up would be WITI, who just retrofitted their main studio and added a brand new studio from scratch, one that is HD ready I'd presume. Still, HD is more than just a set - it's the cameras and everything in the control room. Dunno how much of that was upgraded - I have a faint memory that WITI also upgraded their control room, or at least the switchboard, not too long ago as well.

They replaced their switcher and Chyron a week or so before they started using the FOX O&O graphics.

(I know! It's Sinclair - they're bringing back a newscast on WVTV!!! ;))
Close! It's WPXE! They're launching a HD Newscast called Ion Milwaukee (get it? Eye-on Milwaukee? :D).

[vegasvic]

I'm surprised 58 doesn't still broadcast in black & white.

[LoadStar]

Close! It's WPXE! They're launching a HD Newscast called Ion Milwaukee (get it? Eye-on Milwaukee? :D).

You sure? I heard it would be WVCY. All the news Vic approves of!

[js6751]

Usually these launches of HD newscasts occur on mondays, so I guess it won't be happening this week...

[techboywi]

I personally could care less if any of the stations start doing news in HD. Its not really that huge of a deal to me. Its still going to be the same sensationalictic, over-hyped news that we have now, and there is some newscasters here I'd rather NOT see in extra crystal clear formats.

Now.. I pose this question, if a station upgrades their internal equipment for HD, will they follow suit for remote broadcasts? If I recall correctly, when 58's live truck took a dip in the lake a few years back, a new one cost $250,000 for a SD truck, I'm sure a HD would be MUCH more, and probably not worth it for the occasional live hit from the latest murder scene or Summerfest remote.

I would say the stations would upgrade the studio first and another 6 months or year down the road, put a new remote truck in the mix, or as the current equipment reaches its end of life, upgrade it with a HD equivilent

[js6751]

Is everything still on track?

[WITI6fan]

I assume so.

And has anyone noticed how clear and sharp WITI's studio video has been lately? The color and clarity is much better than it has been before.

[basshive]

So our chance to see Pip and Tim "Bad Sweater Guy" Van Vooren in HD might soon be upon us?! Jen I could stand to look at :D

[js6751]

I have noticed some clearer studio video on their newscasts, which is much better than what it has been in the past. Do you think they're using newer cameras or something? Hopefully a sign of things to come!

[greenskingIV]

Who would want to see Tom Pippins in HD? Seeing him in SD is bad enough!

[techboywi]

Who would want to see Tom Pippins in HD? Seeing him in SD is bad enough!

Or even worse... Bart Adrian... He truly has a face for.....radio

[tunce]

...but Jen Lada will be a nice site. :)

[basshive]

Who would want to see Tom Pippins in HD? Seeing him in SD is bad enough!

Thats what I am saying... NO THANKS :D

[cameralogic]

Still, HD is more than just a set - it's the cameras and everything in the control room.

Well, that's a start. I know because I own two pro HD cams.

One field crew can cost this much to outfit with HD gear. Most medium-sized stations will need 6-12 sets of this gear.

1 HD ENG camera $15000 (low-end, broadcast quality) -or
1 HD ENG camera $35-50,000 (midrange broadcast quality)
1 HD Lens $10,000 standard zoom or $20,000 wide angle
1 HD portable tape playback deck $15000 field/45,000 studio-or
P2-type media (pro memory cards) 32GB $1500 X 4 per camera
P2 reader $1500
Laptop with editing software $2500

It all adds up quickly.
And that doesn't count what you need just in the newsroom. Playback machines for air, networked non-linear editing stations, massive servers with TB's for storage, new newsroom software, new archive systems, HD monitors, cabling, switches, routers, HD test instruments, HD microwave systems for all live trucks, HD receivers...

The good news is that prices are falling quickly for pro HD field gear, and the folks that have waited it out will save some money. But it's still a chunk of change, especially if you are a third or forth place station in a bad economy.


John

[tencom]

Well, that's a start. I know because I own two pro HD cams.

One field crew can cost this much to outfit with HD gear. Most medium-sized stations will need 6-12 sets of this gear.

1 HD ENG camera $15000 (low-end, broadcast quality) -or
1 HD ENG camera $35-50,000 (midrange broadcast quality)
1 HD Lens $10,000 standard zoom or $20,000 wide angle
1 HD portable tape playback deck $15000 field/45,000 studio-or
P2-type media (pro memory cards) 32GB $1500 X 4 per camera
P2 reader $1500
Laptop with editing software $2500

It all adds up quickly.
And that doesn't count what you need just in the newsroom. Playback machines for air, networked non-linear editing stations, massive servers with TB's for storage, new newsroom software, new archive systems, HD monitors, cabling, switches, routers, HD test instruments, HD microwave systems for all live trucks, HD receivers...

The good news is that prices are falling quickly for pro HD field gear, and the folks that have waited it out will save some money. But it's still a chunk of change, especially if you are a third or forth place station in a bad economy.


John


The prices you mention are about the same as they were in the mid sixties, when the conversion to color telecasting was occurring at a rapid pace. With the exception of ENG hardware as they were using 16 millimeter color film cameras to cover news events, which weren't cheap when the cost of color film processing is included.

[js6751]

So do you guys think this will happen this month? Maybe TMJ4 will debut it with their new newscast at 6:30 on monday? Anyone else with possible inside info?

[wxndave]

My guess is no for WTMJ. Like it was said before it takes to much money with little in return for the station. Milwaukee news ingeneral is losing viewers for all stations. If they had better content they might be able to gain viewers. I would buy new cameras that do 16X9 SD and upconvert the studio output.

[John L]

TV stations tend to purchase broadcast equipment from companys who sell their product to commercial broadcasters. They don't even think of purchasing HD cameras from Best Buy.

[jeffski]

I can hardly wait for ANY Milw. station to broadcast 'BREAKING NEWS' every 5 minutes in HD :rolleyes: It would be 'breaking news' if I can watch a whole 30 minutes of news without them saying 'breaking News' :OnAir:

[mrschimpf]

WISN going HD with Oprah and ET on Tuesday (http://www.jsonline.com/story/index.aspx?id=791127)

I guess that you called it right; now we just have to see who blinks first local news-wise.

[basshive]

WISN going HD with Oprah and ET on Tuesday

It is not like these are shows produced by WISN. All they are doing is airing it in HD just like everyone else. WISN already has shows in HD. The question is who is going to be the first station in MKE to produce their own news in HD :D

[mrschimpf]

It is not like these are shows produced by WISN. All they are doing is airing it in HD just like everyone else. WISN already has shows in HD. The question is who is going to be the first station in MKE to produce their own news in HD :D

Understood, but this is a big step because until now, WISN has only aired shows from the live ABC and ESPN feeds, along with the Big Bang. Now they're recording shows from the CBS/Paramount syndicated satellite and airing them in HD. I just wonder if this means from now on, DWTS/Samantha Who? will air in HD after a Packer delay. It's a baby step, but a big one.

[John L]

It is not like these are shows produced by WISN. All they are doing is airing it in HD just like everyone else. WISN already has shows in HD. The question is who is going to be the first station in MKE to produce their own news in HD :D

Up until now all the stations could carry HD programs from the Network. In order for WISN to carry syndicated programming like Oprah, they need special tape delay equipment that can do HD. Apparently they just invested in the equipment and just got it in time for the new fall season. Now if CBS-58 did the same, "Wheel" and "Jeopardy" may go HD.

[basshive]

Even better if the other stations can finally get onboard for the delayed footage!

[tencom]

Up until now all the stations could carry HD programs from the Network. In order for WISN to carry syndicated programming like Oprah, they need special tape delay equipment that can do HD. Apparently they just invested in the equipment and just got it in time for the new fall season. Now if CBS-58 did the same, "Wheel" and "Jeopardy" may go HD.

It May not be a tape delay but also be a direct satellite feed for both shows
satellite time is not that expensive, and may have several repeats, by satellite tailored to local markets.

[John L]

They yet need to get HD studio cameras as well as a HD Master Control before they can do the local News in HD.

[uwgrad]

Up until now all the stations could carry HD programs from the Network. In order for WISN to carry syndicated programming like Oprah, they need special tape delay equipment that can do HD. Apparently they just invested in the equipment and just got it in time for the new fall season. Now if CBS-58 did the same, "Wheel" and "Jeopardy" may go HD.

It May not be a tape delay but also be a direct satellite feed for both shows
satellite time is not that expensive, and may have several repeats, by satellite tailored to local markets.

A direct satellite feed would be ideal for the local station, but it is unlikely that is what is happening.

Most stations (if not all at this point) use video servers for commercial and pre-recorded content playback. Syndicated shows are sent down over a satellite at a specific time earlier in the day, and then that file must be broken into the airable segments. In order for a station to do this in HD, there is a lot of equipment that has to be replaced or upgraded. New satellite receivers that are HD capable. The server will need more storage space since as we all know HD takes up alot more hard drive space. HD input/output cards for the server, either SD downconverting equipment so that the video can be viewed properly on the multiple existing SD monitors and segmenting stations, or replace all of these monitors with new HD capable ones, audio decoders in order to listen to the audio on all of the analog speakers, running all new wiring, and lastly getting the computer systems to talk nicely to everything.

It's alot of work and kudos to WISN for pulling this off, and hopefully other local stations will upgrade their systems soon, although I wonder if they're waiting until February when analog goes away so that there is only one signal path to deal with. That will simplify the upgrade significantly.

As to local HD news, again, that is a huge undertaking. It would pretty much require complete replacement of most of the equipment throughout the building. The studio cameras themselves are one of the easiest upgrades, although still pricey if they go top of the line - $100,000 per camera. The biggest upgrade is all the control room, master control, and newsroom equipment - the monitors, speakers, graphics systems, recording decks, router system, etc. Upgrading to HD field footage is even more expensive.

Another thing to consider is redesigning the studio sets. They were designed for 4:3 framing, and when they shoot widescreen, most likely there will be issues with unwanted things getting in the shot.

[REVM1M]

Dr. Phill is HD on ch 12. Probably Oprah too later at 4:00 p.m. But Ellen is not on CBS 58. There you go again Jim Hall:bang: :bang:

[REVM1M]

Yes Oprah is HD :D :D thank you CH12.

[tunce]

Wow every thread as a nasty comment about Jim Hall...

Deservingly so - :D